Frost Trinkets Question

[Inception]

Just a quick question about trinkets for frost. Along with the class trinket, should I be using Sethe or prophecy of fear?

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[Rinoa]

Generally speaking, Sethe on single target and Prophecy on multi target.

[Inception]

Thats exactly what I needed to know, Thank you!

[Curnivore]

Council's trinket is probably better on single target. Even for arcane by the way, at least in some cases. I expect prophecy is best on frost in several cases, but, it might require some intuitive thinking with giving some priority to ice lances when doom is up because the default simcraft script doesn't do anything special about it.

[Inception]

Is there a good addon to monitor the mark of doom from prophecy?

[Frosted]

Is there a good addon to monitor the mark of doom from prophecy?

You should be able to find some weak aura strings for this in the addon subforum.

[Rinoa]

Council's trinket is probably better on single target. Even for arcane by the way, at least in some cases. I expect prophecy is best on frost in several cases, but, it might require some intuitive thinking with giving some priority to ice lances when doom is up because the default simcraft script doesn't do anything special about it.

Could you post your findings about Desecrated Shadowmoon Insignia being BiS for single target Frost, assuming you aren't just parroting Komma's comment about it possibly being BiS on <20 second long fights? I'm curious to see in what way it outperforms Prophecy of Fear/Unblinking Gaze of Sethe on fights that don't have a fight length in the shortest 0.1% of raids when stacking burst classes.

[Curnivore]

Could you post your findings about Desecrated Shadowmoon Insignia being BiS for single target Frost, assuming you aren't just parroting Komma's comment about it possibly being BiS on <20 second long fights? I'm curious to see in what way it outperforms Prophecy of Fear/Unblinking Gaze of Sethe on fights that don't have a fight length in the shortest 0.1% of raids when stacking burst classes.

Oh I don't parrot anyone, and I'm not alone. We recently had a thread (either here or mmo champion mage) about someone asking for a BiS list he found that had it 1st (I suppose it was a webpage posted by someone only running single-target simulations on frost). I personally saw it being best on Arcane when I was running regular setups on Patchwerk that lasted regular lengths (around 300 seconds if I recall correctly) when I had a mix of heroic and mythic gear 2-3 months ago (troll race, which might matter).

[Rinoa]

It can indeed compete for BiS for single target Arcane, but I have yet to see anything that shows it's as good as Gaze or PoF for Frost on fights that aren't extremely short.

[Curnivore]

I would comment that in general it might best to refer to fight lengths and fight types when reporting simcraft results. (In most discussions here and elsewhere we tend to say what is best without referring to the length and type.) I do not know what fight length the list I saw used but it had it first, and I bet it was single target for it to manage to be first.

[Rinoa]

After having done some research, it does appear as though more recent changes in the Frost APL - guessing it's the optimizations that were made not long ago - have strengthened DSI when compared to the other trinkets on pure single target. I knew it was strong as it synergises well with Nithramus + PC + IV + TW in the opener, but it is indeed stronger than I realized.

I did some sims in the standard Frost T18M profile, and DSI > Gaze, the gap is significant on very short fight but narrows as the fight length increases. This will change a bit based on the gear of the specific player, mind you, as this is a gear profile with no WF or sockets.

In regards to the fight length and type, I agree. Gear and talent choices always depend heavily on what a fight requires. When talking about SimC and non default setups it is highly useful to mention what kind of configuration one is using.

[Curnivore]

It's also harder for people to notice those things because the regular mythic raider will not run frost on single target. The right simcraft setup for it is likely aiming for a Velhari simulation which is 2 X Patchwerk. Then again lately with the shorter fights and the potency of the ring for Arcane (and some others going fire for the lols) they might not even be doing that.

[Komma]

The strength of DSI within sims is also partially due to using PC, which magnifies the power of Ice Lances quite a bit. Since Ice Lances benefit most from spellpower (thanks to Shatterlance), DSI's proc synergizes really well with it. Between the main lance hitting for ~250K and Splitting Ice hitting for ~120K, it's quite a powerful combo, though not anywhere near the insanity we see with Arcane. The Splitting Ice effect doesn't work when using TV though, so you'll have to adjust talents to your liking.