M+ Talents/Legendaries?

[Delandel]

Obviously this depends on the dungeon/affixes, but what are your go-to builds across the M+ dungeons for, say, 15-17 keys?

Do you always run the single target build for Tyrannical? Upper Kara? Any deviations?

What about for mob-heavy dungeons, or affixes with Teeming? Or Fortified/Bolstering like this week?

What about legendaries? Mantle is obvious, but what's the next legendary? Kilt? Shard?

Do you guys stick to IF for M+ or do you recommend RoP instead?

Just a Fire mage trying to learn Arcane! Thanks for reading.

[Yifei]

Legys: Shoulder/Kilt
Talents: 2/2/3/3/1/3/3
so do I in M+

[Naustis]

Obviously this depends on the dungeon/affixes, but what are your go-to builds across the M+ dungeons for, say, 15-17 keys?

Do you always run the single target build for Tyrannical? Upper Kara? Any deviations?

What about for mob-heavy dungeons, or affixes with Teeming? Or Fortified/Bolstering like this week?

What about legendaries? Mantle is obvious, but what's the next legendary? Kilt? Shard?

Do you guys stick to IF for M+ or do you recommend RoP instead?

Just a Fire mage trying to learn Arcane! Thanks for reading.

It all depends how you play the run. Kilt + Sephuz is bis for trash mobs, mantle + kilt is only better if you are hitting 5 tagets. Above and below that kilt + sephuz outscales mantle + kilt.

Moreover, it is worth to change your gear before pulling the boss, soul + shard is recommende for that as fights are short anyway.

And about IF vs RoP. I am going for RoP during tyrannical, and IF other days.

[Sadlo]

For any affixes or bosses (like curator) that have high movement, IF seems to do better. If you can manage the high movement while utilizing ROP, ROP is better.

As far as legendaries, Sim the fuck out of yourself. During fort week, you're talking about 4-6 targets on average in which case Shoulders/Sephuz sim the highest (for me)
For ST during fort week you still want to switch legies before the boss. (I use kilt/archmage or kilt/timewarp depending on cds)

Also you need a prydaz set for aides bosses, so sometimes you will need prydaz/x legendary. I normally take a ring, but some will prefer kilt.

just my 2cents from a 2100 m+ mage.

also, learn frost for certain dungeons because 2 ice blocks is just better sometimes...

sadlo#1909 if you have more questions

[wannalink]

It all depends how you play the run. Kilt + Sephuz is bis for trash mobs, mantle + kilt is only better if you are hitting 5 tagets. Above and below that kilt + sephuz outscales mantle + kilt.

Current APL for mantle uses barrage only against >4 targets, instead of >2 targets.

Difference in terms of damages is huge. It's the second time this patch i've stumbled upon on significant flaws in arcane sims, so i would advice everyone to proofread it very carefully.

[nickseng]

That line is during burn phase.
I assume you don't use Barrage when burning, right?

[wannalink]

Sims for my toon, with kilt+mantle.
3 targets, default setting.

4 targets.


Disclaimer: i do not know if its indeed an optimal rotation (in particular: using abarr even during AP), BUT its definitely better than stock APL.

[testacular]

Do you always run the single target build for Tyrannical? Upper Kara? Any deviations?

Tyrannical is a very dps demanding check in high M+. You need to be able to dish out a lot of DPS. So yea, I go ST most of the time, only changing between Rune of Power and Incanter's Flow (for instance with Volanic you want IF). You may also choose between Charged Up and Resonance but usually you want Resonance for more group DPS. I also tend to take Slipstream so that I can stay around my RoP but still avoid stuff while channeling missiles.

BUT!!! I do change gear for packs fights and boss fights! I take Mantle and Kilt while clearing mobs (and different trinkets) and I swap to Shard + Kilt like one pack before boss (along with trinkets, which will get 30sec CD by this, if they are on-use). Remember that you can use invisibility to swap this even in trash combat.

What about for mob-heavy dungeons, or affixes with Teeming? Or Fortified/Bolstering like this week?

In this I usually differ from most guys around here - I do play with Arcane Orb as a talent and Resonance along with that. I mostly take Incanter's Flow as I am moving a lot (we are almost melee with Arcane Explosion so you don't want to get hit some AOE from +17 Fortified Bolstered monter, right?). For similar reason I tend to choose Shimmer in second tier. I again wear Mantle and Kilt for trash and swap for bosses.

With the above setup you become absolute monster AOE DPS. You are able to re-gain arcane charges repeatedly and you nearly cannot run out of mana thanks to Kilt. However, note that your ST DPS won't be top in that party. Then again, in affixes like those you spend most of the time fighting trash, so it should be well worth it.

As a side note - do not hesitate to use CDs (even AP) on trash packs, after all with these affixes you spend most time there. Just make sure you will have it somewhat ready for boss fights (if you pop it 10-15 sec into boss fight, that's still good).

What about legendaries? Mantle is obvious, but what's the next legendary? Kilt? Shard?

As I said - Mantle + Kilt for trash; Shard+Kilt for bosses in my case (some would take double ring perhaps? But I lack mastery for that).

Do you guys stick to IF for M+ or do you recommend RoP instead?

Just ask yourself -> "Will I be able to repeatedly stand for 10 seconds in one spot?"
If it's volcanic, you won't. If it's Skittish, you might have troubles as well but it's unlikely.
If you are sweeping quickly through packs, it might not be worth it.
Also take into consideration that IF gives bonus at all times while RoP is "spikey" - you have it, or you don't. Make use of that and pick it for dungeons where you will need those spikes badly and make sure you have it ready (oh, hello CoS Inquisitors! )

Just a Fire mage trying to learn Arcane! Thanks for reading.

Take all I said with a pinch of salt, many people around here will probably disagree with me, but here I am playing arcane ever since and still standing strong and alive in resulting charts
May the arcane force be with you mon!

[wannalink]

I do play with Arcane Orb as a talent

Can you please provide any simc scenario as an example, where orb outperforms Overpowered?

[testacular]

I do play with Arcane Orb as a talent

Can you please provide any simc scenario as an example, where orb outperforms Overpowered?

No, I cannot.
Sadly, I have no time to compose such scenario myself because SimC doesn't really count with it . As you yourself posted here though, it misuses Orb sometimes (only using it on 4+ targets which isn't really great) so any calculations with it might be a bit "corrupted".

What I am talking about is overall, group to group, DPS performance in M+ where the packs are the tough part. Excluding TW - you don't use it there and also note that you cannot use AP at all times, some packs are too small for that (you wouldn't make full use of the potential). WIth Orb you can consistenly dish out crazy AoE damage while Arcane Power only provides "momentary" boost on one pack.
If you know how to "simulate" this, feel free to go ahead, I am just talking from my personal experience. With Orb, the playstyle is a lot smoother and I tend to have better overall DPS on packs, or tend to top off DPS more often to put it that way.