My opinion on the current state of frost mage

[Burnthemall]

Hello all frost mages,

just did yesterday a lot of testing and I have to admit that the spec after nerf is boring as hell I cannot help myself but there is a lot of downtime when Iam only shooting frostbolts and waiting (praying) for proc and it is not fun at all.

I can really feel the nerf of T19 and the nerf of IV. IV on average lasts 43s and than you wait for long time to get new IV. Now this spec is more RNG than before. Sometimes during first 20s of IV I get a few ice lances and the burst dmg is lower in general

I really hope that the ToS items and T20 change the flow of spec because now it is not doing well from fun perspective. Dmg is still alright we are middle pack now but the flow of spec is away according my feeling.

I even tried GS build in NH and in M+13 but wtf i cannot help myself the casting speed is so low (8% haste) that I thought that I fall asleep in comparison with IV build and gear when I have 31% haste.

I am thinking about rerolling fire mage even that it is the worst dps spec nowadays but at least it is more fun.

I hope I'm not the only one who has a similar opinion to me.

Have a nice day

S.

[Frostienips]

Didnt they say there would be another numbers tune later this week?
Then they usually do another pass just before Mythic comes out using the 1 week of normal/heroic data.

I will wait for them before I make any adjustments to which spec I will play.
Most likely will continue what I enjoy, which is Frost - aslong as I can use LW.

[pleblius]

TV is a little bit more boring now, I have to admit. But the change did smooth out the damage curve slightly: The swing from good procs and 100% IV up-time and terrible procs and 20% up-time is nowhere near as extreme now.
The only really notable thing (Other than the massive nerf to gloves, which stings because I still don't have Shard/Mag's) is the loss of double IL, which I felt was a fun little mini-game.

Strongly disagree that fire is currently more fun than Frost. GS build is pretty abysmal, but TV still seems fine. Still near the top in DPS and nothing significant has changed rotationally.

[Murm]

This was my biggest fear originally when i read the frost changes. No longer do you have to track haste procs (or any procs really), be aware of positioning, race against time to keep that IV going, all that is gone. Now you just stand there and respond the same way to 2 procs the entire fight. It is SO BORING. And easy. I imagine the difference between a great mage and a mediocre one will be very small now whereas before there was a big difference. I have all the fire leggos and play that for any fight that allows it, but honestly it's just bad and has been for a long time now. I really hope they tweak the numbers a bit to make it somewhat viable, but given their track record so far i don't have high hopes.

[itchynose]

Very disheartening. Used GS for heroic NH farm to practice and get ready for ToS and it was awful. At first it was fun seeing those big GS crits, but it was soon followed by torment and misery. Spamming FB with low haste is mind numbing, and the downward side of a Whispers Proc...might as well dance for 8sec while it wears off.

Went back to TV, and its not much better with lack of double IL, TV nerf, T19 nerf. No challenge, no squeeze, middle of the pack dps. Sigh.

[Frostienips]

Very disheartening. Used GS for heroic NH farm to practice and get ready for ToS and it was awful. At first it was fun seeing those big GS crits, but it was soon followed by torment and misery. Spamming FB with low haste is mind numbing, and the downward side of a Whispers Proc...might as well dance for 8sec while it wears off.

Went back to TV, and its not much better with lack of double IL, TV nerf, T19 nerf. No challenge, no squeeze, middle of the pack dps. Sigh.

iirc there is alot of haste mastery gear in ToS and Crit Mastery so there is potential to raise haste levels
.

[AaronWilson]

So I did Mythic NH last night.

GS is pretty... ehh to play. Mythic Skorp I did well, Chromatic I did well and Trilliax I was like 7th due to being bullied by mechanics.

If you have to move alot GS is really hard to shatter, if you can turret mode you can be top 5. Very much middle of the pack on mobile fights.

[Nyrilla]

I think it's too soon to draw conclusions on the viability of TV or GS specs. Those specs might have been designed taking in account the T20 4P bonuses (I'm pretty sure that coupling 2P NH and 4P ToS won't be worth it) which will add something to the gameplay as well as boosting outputs. Timing the use of our procs to benefit as much as possible of the orb's damage bonus instead of just spamming FB and throwing our IL & BF procs from time to time may be cool...

So let's wait for the new bonuses and maybe mages will be on top charts again

[Pewboom]

This was my biggest fear originally when i read the frost changes. No longer do you have to track haste procs (or any procs really), be aware of positioning, race against time to keep that IV going, all that is gone. Now you just stand there and respond the same way to 2 procs the entire fight. It is SO BORING. And easy. I imagine the difference between a great mage and a mediocre one will be very small now whereas before there was a big difference. I have all the fire leggos and play that for any fight that allows it, but honestly it's just bad and has been for a long time now. I really hope they tweak the numbers a bit to make it somewhat viable, but given their track record so far i don't have high hopes.

Actually you can still shimmerlance so you have to track your haste,your distance and your shimmer charges to maximize that...still it's not that much to do outside IV/lust/Whisper proc.I was pulling some nasty numbers on Augur M last night,on our best try i was at 1.27M dps with some crazy rng luck but the boss decided to bug out and reset at 4%...rip kill

[sawbossnl]

Actually you can still shimmerlance so you have to track your haste,your distance and your shimmer charges to maximize that...still it's not that much to do outside IV/lust/Whisper proc.I was pulling some nasty numbers on Augur M last night,on our best try i was at 1.27M dps with some crazy rng luck but the boss decided to bug out and reset at 4%...rip kill[/quote]

I like the fact that you say it yourself.

I was pulling some nasty numbers on Augur M last night,on our best try i was at 1.27M dps with some crazy rng luck

The point that you need that to do some crazy dps is just sad

The skill of a mage is all gone everything is just the most simple rotation you can have atm
Even arcane fuck hell thats a easy spec to learn but the mana management is so fucking borring

[Laniarty]

This is what some arcane mages felt like after Quickening was canned. The skill cap of the class has been lowered by removing double icelance, and now the skill becomes how you deal with mechanics and not how skillfully you play. Like it or not, this is how WoW is. If you discover a way to play that is different, but technically not how the developers want the game to be played, it will be nerfed. It doesn't matter if that made the spec fun or not.

[Tenzarin]

I would rather work on mechanics and not staying in melee range waiting for haste procs to do good dmg.

[Moraxus]

As it is right now clearly frost Mage is not working well
First it's obvious that it's made to work with new t20 but how good will be we gonna have to wait and see.(few more days,GL to all with the loot)
Second if I remember well in Emerald nightmare blizzard nerfed the GS explaining that it wasn't how they want frost to be played (correct me if I'm wrong)because mages with GS where loosing procs from our passives and where skipping basic gameplay,now they try to bring it back
I've try GS and on my point of view it's not fun an definetly not rewarding and make you skip or delay things that actually are more fun then just spamming FB
I think comparing mages specs is wrong we need to compare with different clases
For example warriors being mele are 10x more useful then every mage spec warlock same even boomkin ( which r performing really well after latest changes ) are more useful
Clearly something is missing from all our specs and my biggest concern is that blizzard won't adres any changes at any of the Mage specs
Good luck in ToS all

[AaronWilson]

Did a HC NH Farm run last night. (We killed HC Gul'Dan/Elisande at the end of our mythic progression raid Thursday)

HC Skorp the 3 frost mages sat at around 1.5mil - 9th
HC Chromatic - 827k - 3rd
HC Triliax - 708k - 3rd
HC Spellblade - 971k - 1st
HC Tichondrius - 936k - 5th
HC Botanist - 800k 8th (I derped, died to solar collapse and then got Bresd, screwed with my DPS)
HC Krosus - 750k - 4th

I think we will be fine in ToS.

[Cooldownslol]

Did a HC NH Farm run last night. (We killed HC Gul'Dan/Elisande at the end of our mythic progression raid Thursday)

HC Skorp the 3 frost mages sat at around 1.5mil - 9th
HC Chromatic - 827k - 3rd
HC Triliax - 708k - 3rd
HC Spellblade - 971k - 1st
HC Tichondrius - 936k - 5th
HC Botanist - 800k 8th (I derped, died to solar collapse and then got Bresd, screwed with my DPS)
HC Krosus - 750k - 4th

I think we will be fine in ToS.

Those numbers are low for heroic this late into the tier. I am a "heroic" raider I don't do mythic raiding but I'm over a million DPS on every single one of those fights some more than others obviously, with sometimes being at 950 on Tril/Krosus depending on RNG. Comparing yourself to your guild/raid that had subpar DPS does not provide any insight into how well Frost will do in ToS.

Not to mention that's not the point. Warlock was better in NH and they got buffs and a second spec that will also do really well in ToS, yet frost gets nerfed and Fire got absolutely destroyed in EN for being in the same boat that Warlock is now. Blizzards actions make zero sense this expansion and are very inconsistent to say the least.

[Burnthemall]

Did a HC NH Farm run last night. (We killed HC Gul'Dan/Elisande at the end of our mythic progression raid Thursday)

HC Skorp the 3 frost mages sat at around 1.5mil - 9th
HC Chromatic - 827k - 3rd
HC Triliax - 708k - 3rd
HC Spellblade - 971k - 1st
HC Tichondrius - 936k - 5th
HC Botanist - 800k 8th (I derped, died to solar collapse and then got Bresd, screwed with my DPS)
HC Krosus - 750k - 4th

I think we will be fine in ToS.

These numbers are really low and dunno how you could be first as frost mage on Spellblade but nvm before patch I had with 907 item level for example 1,15 milions dps on trillax /krosus and on the Cromatic 1,25 mil dps. After the patch the dps dropped abouts 17 % approximatelly for my gear.

Personally I do not have problem with frost dps but with the flow of spec and entertaiment. Glacial spkie is boring for me and TV built has now a lot of downtime without procs and IV buff. We will see how it will go with ToS gear.

[Naiyano]

I lost about 100k-200k dps depending on the fight. But who cares anyway. NH HC is just a gigantic zerg and it's all about procs these days. We will see what's coming in TOS.

I do agree that frostmage in it's current state is really boring and sometimes i just cast 10 frostbolts in a row. At least i have time now to look at the surroundings and people who don't do mechanics. Occasionally i do a shimmer lance if the mechanics allow for it and otherwise i just stand there and press my frostbolt button. Really fun gameplay. Job well done Blizzard.

[ColdasIce]

Did a HC NH Farm run last night. (We killed HC Gul'Dan/Elisande at the end of our mythic progression raid Thursday)

HC Skorp the 3 frost mages sat at around 1.5mil - 9th
HC Chromatic - 827k - 3rd
HC Triliax - 708k - 3rd
HC Spellblade - 971k - 1st
HC Tichondrius - 936k - 5th
HC Botanist - 800k 8th (I derped, died to solar collapse and then got Bresd, screwed with my DPS)
HC Krosus - 750k - 4th

I think we will be fine in ToS.

Is there any chance farm runs (especially heroic, but even Mythic so late in the tier) will ever stop being used as proof for a spec "doing well"?

My guess is no, never. For some reason, it keeps repeating on and on, then when the same people thinking "we're just fine!" finally join a mythic guild and do progress, the shock is real. Just imagine soaking at the very end of the bridge mid Icy Veins at Krosus. Having to move to the edge of the platform with flames during CDs, which you cannot delay that much, because you would end up with FEWER across the whole fight. The examples are numerous.

To "do well", your spec should be able to compete for the TOP SPOT for your role, in this case, ranged, and some times, even with the melee, in case you don't need as many ranged - all this while executing mechanics as required. This was the spot mages had at least a spec in for most of the game's life.

TL;DR: Being average is NOT a mage thing.

[Frantik]

TL;DR: Being average is NOT a mage thing.

Well that's clearly not how blizzard sees it...

Things change,game is evolving and so is the status quo of classes if blizz says mage is average then it is average..maybe next patch they decide it should be top ..

[Katsumi]

I lost about 100k-200k dps depending on the fight. But who cares anyway. NH HC is just a gigantic zerg and it's all about procs these days. We will see what's coming in TOS.

I do agree that frostmage in it's current state is really boring and sometimes i just cast 10 frostbolts in a row. At least i have time now to look at the surroundings and people who don't do mechanics. Occasionally i do a shimmer lance if the mechanics allow for it and otherwise i just stand there and press my frostbolt button. Really fun gameplay. Job well done Blizzard.

This.