[BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Guides and discussions of all things specific to the Ice Lancers of Azeroth.
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Vexim
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Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby Vexim Mon Sep 10, 2018 3:19 pm

Hey guys,
Question, are we shattering an IL after GS/EB casts like the standard IV rotation?
I'm not seeing it in the SimC APL so leading me to believe we only cast IL on FoF proc.

I think i'm wasting DPS by shattering the IL's after these spells.

ty in advance.
nickseng
Posts: 240
Joined: Mon Jun 09, 2014 3:52 am

Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby nickseng Tue Sep 11, 2018 5:58 am

Hey guys,
Question, are we shattering an IL after GS/EB casts like the standard IV rotation?
I'm not seeing it in the SimC APL so leading me to believe we only cast IL on FoF proc.

I think i'm wasting DPS by shattering the IL's after these spells.

ty in advance.
What
You don't shatter an IL after GS/EB casts in standard IV Rotation, you shatter them after flurry. Always.
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Vexim
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Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby Vexim Tue Sep 11, 2018 6:23 am

Yeh of course, but when you shatter the GS/EB with Flurry follow with IL also?
It's what i've been doing, but i feel my dps is a bit low. Was Just confirming.
Last edited by Vexim on Tue Sep 11, 2018 9:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
Windfray
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Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby Windfray Tue Sep 11, 2018 6:41 am

I have a question that I don't think has been answered yet. Am I using Ebonbolt off CD, or only to gain a flurry for my GS?
So for example if I have 2 icicles and ebonbolt comes off CD, do I use the ebonbolt straight away for a shattered IL, or do I continue casting to 5 and only use if needed? I haven't tested it yet, but I feel like using it off CD could be the go here, just based on the philosophy of never stop casting.
Greddy
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Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby Greddy Tue Sep 11, 2018 7:29 am

I have a question that I don't think has been answered yet. Am I using Ebonbolt off CD, or only to gain a flurry for my GS?
So for example if I have 2 icicles and ebonbolt comes off CD, do I use the ebonbolt straight away for a shattered IL, or do I continue casting to 5 and only use if needed? I haven't tested it yet, but I feel like using it off CD could be the go here, just based on the philosophy of never stop casting.
Based on what I've read (over and over), the rule is simple:

Ebonbolt is there as a safety net for your Glacial spike. You cast it only if you're on 5 Icicles and you don't have a Brain freeze proc. If you're getting lucky with the procs and you "don't have to" cast it, you just don't.

...that seems to be the general consensus (because you always want to shatter your Glacial spike and waiting for the proc makes you lose dmg).
nickseng
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Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby nickseng Tue Sep 11, 2018 9:50 am

Yeh of course, but when you shatter the GS/EB with Flurry follow with IL also?
It's what i've been doing, but i feel my dps is a bit low. Was Just confirming.
Correct.
WonkyCombo
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Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:06 pm

Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby WonkyCombo Wed Sep 12, 2018 5:19 pm

Hi Folks,

I'm trying to confirm something that seems counter-intuitive to me. Specifically, if I understand the frost single target priority list correctly, then it appears that bleeding off FoF procs takes precedence over casting a fully prepped (5 icicle, BF buff up) Glacial Spike. My further understanding is that when bleeding off FoF procs, one is always casting a Frostbolt with each Ice Lance (unless prevented from doing so by movement) so that each attempt to bleed an existing FoF simultaneously has a chance to proc both another FoF and a Brain Freeze. So, if everything I've just said is true, then attempting to bleed FoFs before beginning the Glacial Spike combo risks munching Brain Freezes.

My question boils down to: is it actually a DPS gain to potentially munch BF's like this instead of starting the GS combo even with an outstanding FoF (and thereby munching the FoF)? It strikes me as counterintuitive because I had the impression that a single BF was worth more than a single FoF. That said, I guess I'm comparing "the risk of munching" the BF against the certainty of munching the FoF. Is that why bleeding off the FoFs comes out ahead?

Edit: I raise the question because I'm seeing Brain Freeze overwrite rates of about 21-25% in my raid parses, and I believe the primary source of these are the FoF bleedoff casts.

Appreciate the help!
nickseng
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Joined: Mon Jun 09, 2014 3:52 am

Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby nickseng Thu Sep 13, 2018 5:33 am

I'm not sure where you're reading that, but FOF almost never takes priority if there is a chance you'd much a BF. If you're midcasting FB and have both BF and FOF, you'd cast the flurry and munch the FOF

There is almost no reason to purposely cast FB before IL. This is a remnant from Legion where there was a negligable difference to doing so. There isn't one now.

And finally, due to how GS plays (you're holding BF procs at 3+ icicles), you're almost certainly going to much BF procs.
WonkyCombo
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Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby WonkyCombo Thu Sep 13, 2018 3:35 pm

There is almost no reason to purposely cast FB before IL. This is a remnant from Legion where there was a negligable difference to doing so. There isn't one now.

Ok, I had missed this change. I didn’t realize that the “always precede IL with FB” rule, which I’d internalized perhaps too deeply during Legion, was only in place because of an Ebonchill artifact trait. Fact that I’ve continued to do it Is probably exacerbating my BF overwrite rate that WoWAnalyzer is hammering me over. Also possibly costing me IL damage during Frozen Orbs.

Thank you.
Chuntsy
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Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2018 8:08 pm

Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby Chuntsy Fri Sep 21, 2018 8:10 pm

Quick question, raid buffed with Crit food and the Origination Array buff im sitting at around 26% crit. Is there a crit cap I should be working towards?
nickseng
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Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby nickseng Mon Sep 24, 2018 8:05 am

No. Just follow your simmed stat weight.
Episodes
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Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:42 am

Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby Episodes Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:51 am

Hey guys was just wondering is it a dps loss to wait 5 seconds to get maximum dps from your inchanter’s flow talent before casting gs/flurry IL combo or just dumping it at any stack? Sorry if someone has mentioned this I may have missed it
nickseng
Posts: 240
Joined: Mon Jun 09, 2014 3:52 am

Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby nickseng Tue Oct 09, 2018 8:47 am

Hey guys was just wondering is it a dps loss to wait 5 seconds to get maximum dps from your inchanter’s flow talent before casting gs/flurry IL combo or just dumping it at any stack? Sorry if someone has mentioned this I may have missed it
Nope. Don't play around IF stacks
Chuntsy
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Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2018 8:08 pm

Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby Chuntsy Fri Oct 12, 2018 3:41 am

Alright, im currently running my Azerite gear as such; 3 Archive of the Titans on first wheel and 2 overwhelming power/1 Heed my call on the second wheel.

After simming for my best gear on raidbots, it shows that I should be using 1 Tidal Surge/1 Lazer Matrix/1 Dagger in back on the first wheel and 1 Overwhelming power/1 Earthlink/1 Heed my call on the second wheel

Should I stick with what bloodmallet and herodmg show and just stick with the 3 Archive of the Titans or go with what the sims are showing?? I have 6 stacks of the Reorigination Array.
Laodi
Posts: 79
Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 2:50 pm

Re: [BFA T22] Frost Mage PvE Raiding Guide.

Unread postby Laodi Fri Oct 12, 2018 3:57 pm

Alright, im currently running my Azerite gear as such; 3 Archive of the Titans on first wheel and 2 overwhelming power/1 Heed my call on the second wheel.

After simming for my best gear on raidbots, it shows that I should be using 1 Tidal Surge/1 Lazer Matrix/1 Dagger in back on the first wheel and 1 Overwhelming power/1 Earthlink/1 Heed my call on the second wheel

Should I stick with what bloodmallet and herodmg show and just stick with the 3 Archive of the Titans or go with what the sims are showing?? I have 6 stacks of the Reorigination Array.
You should read Bloodmallet in the right way.
3 Archive of Titans vs 3 "inserst rnd trait" allways shows Archives as the best. But that doesn't imply that 3 Archive of Titans is BiS.
The First Archive gives you (with +5 RA): 1064 DPS
The Second Archive gives you: 1495 DPS. That is an increase of 431 DPS.
The Third Archive: 1936 or +441

The First Tidal Surge gives you 490 DPS, the first DitB 534
The main Problem here is that the traits dont stack linearly. They loose value the more often u have them. So the theoretically best is:
1Archive (1064) + 1Tidal(490)+1DitB(534) = 2088
Same Calculation for inner wheel

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