Frost Talents, Stat Weights, Racials, Trinkets, FAQ

[TLTeo]

Nop that's how Frost plays atm

[gameorg]

Hey frosted, as already mentioned i appreciate your work!

Can you tell me with what item level u ran the trinket sim?

Insignia 620 or 660?
Sandmann 640 or higher?
HC trinkets 630 or 636?

[Frosted]

DMC was 3/3 upgraded, HC were 630. Insignia I'm not sure, trolltok would know.

[Frosted]

So I started to wonder about how PC would do without splitting ice on single target, since tall bosses basically mean you cannot cleave off PC. So I modified the APL to Fbomb on PC to take that into account, and ran talent sims:



TV > PC on single target if the boss is too tall. TV is potentially the most potent single target and multi-target talent!

[gameorg]

DMC was 3/3 upgraded, HC were 630. Insignia I'm not sure, trolltok would know.

did some math and iam pretty sure it was 620 insignia.

[Komma]

So I started to wonder about how PC would do without splitting ice on single target, since tall bosses basically mean you cannot cleave off PC. So I modified the APL to Fbomb on PC to take that into account, and ran talent sims:



TV > PC on single target if the boss is too tall. TV is potentially the most potent single target and multi-target talent!

I'm pretty sure that something is wrong with that APL. The difference between PC on boss and PC on crystal is not nearly that big.

[Frosted]

There is no splitting ice cleave at all in those sims, not just Fbomb swap to PC.

[Komma]

There is no splitting ice cleave at all in those sims, not just Fbomb swap to PC.

Oh, of course. That nakes sense now - PC is basically balanced with the assumption that you use splitting ice. Nevermind what I said.

[Vasya111]

Sorry, i dont understand. Why dps is much lower than in initial post even for talent combos without PC?

[Frosted]

Because I need to re-do them now that trinkets have been nerfed.

[Saluk]

What about inifinity IV without IV glyph? Any one tested it ? Someone wrote glyphed IV is ~5% dmg lose in MI+TV. Your sims with MI+TV got glyph or maby I missed something. PC is really problematic. For other ppl it is so small almost invisible and tanks often move boss away from it.

[peremptalis]

Sup.
First of all, thanks for your work frosted.
I'm kinda newish to real in-depth simcraft shizzle. I read through all posts, read stuff on different sites and tested shit ingame - and I feel like multistrike just works the best for me atm. But when I take a look at other people's gear it confuses me why no one has this MS stack as I do, or completely leaves out on versatility while it's so high up in the stats weight. My burst is at over 30k dps and drops down hc to around 19-22k at the boss-kill, and I do not really feel the clunky gameplay other people mentioned. Sure, rng can be a bitch procwise but I doesn't effect me that much. ( http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/f ... x/advanced" target="_blank )

Besides that, I'd like to know which stat I should aim for when the raids are out because obviously I can not stack MS infinitely (if that would even make any sense). Played mage vanilla - bc and picked it up again shortly before WoD, so I still have a problem regarding what to focus on.
If anything of this has been answered before my post I apologize and admit I'm a tool.

[Ablazer]

Ah I see, thanks for the reply.

In your simulation, how do you handle the staggered cooldowns of frozen orb and PC? Whats the optimal way to use these two?

Lets use an example of a 3:15 fight, obviously you use both on the opener, then 1 minute in your orb comes back up. You could use it there, and then at 1:30 into the fight have a comparatively weak power crystal since there's no orb to guarantee you can spam lance. Then at 2 minutes you get another frost orb, then at 3 minutes you get to use them both again. Alternatively you could use frozen orb as if it had a 90 second cooldown, and only use it with PC. Have you run any tests on which one is better?

any thoughts on this?

[gameorg]

@previous poster: I would say it depends on the situation. If u build up 2 FoF and 2 FFB Procs and maybe even have 2 ice nova ready there is no point in waiting for Orb. And considering that u have pet to get FoF procs its not that hard to set up this scenario.

On single target there is little reason to wait at all. If there is an AOE fight or u dont have procs it will be more efficient to wait for both cds. It really is situational.


I doubt that u reach the multistrike cap (if there is one at all?) any time soon.

Just go for the stat priorities listed on page 1. Id go for multistrike and versatility all the way, because it allows you to be flexible the most. Other than that it really depends on what skills u choose. Haste is pretty bad atm, but if u take mirror image, it suddenly scales quite good.

If you wana switch spec (like fire gets a good buff) suddenly crit is way more valueable than multistrike and versatility... its really not that easy now to pick gear.

The real task is to actually take a look at your current gear and evaluate if things like MI or IF would be better to choose.

@Frosted: Btw i just saw that multistrike is scaling low on IN_MI_TV. How is that? From a logical point of view i would assumethat multistrike becomes more important when using tv, as more multiprocs mean more frost lance procs prolonging the icy veins buff?

[Frosted]

What about inifinity IV without IV glyph? Any one tested it ? Someone wrote glyphed IV is ~5% dmg lose in MI+TV. Your sims with MI+TV got glyph or maby I missed something. PC is really problematic. For other ppl it is so small almost invisible and tanks often move boss away from it.

DPS loss right now to use unglyphed IV in pre-raid gear.

[Frosted]

Sup.
First of all, thanks for your work frosted.
I'm kinda newish to real in-depth simcraft shizzle. I read through all posts, read stuff on different sites and tested shit ingame - and I feel like multistrike just works the best for me atm. But when I take a look at other people's gear it confuses me why no one has this MS stack as I do, or completely leaves out on versatility while it's so high up in the stats weight. My burst is at over 30k dps and drops down hc to around 19-22k at the boss-kill, and I do not really feel the clunky gameplay other people mentioned. Sure, rng can be a bitch procwise but I doesn't effect me that much. ( http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/f ... x/advanced" target="_blank )

Besides that, I'd like to know which stat I should aim for when the raids are out because obviously I can not stack MS infinitely (if that would even make any sense). Played mage vanilla - bc and picked it up again shortly before WoD, so I still have a problem regarding what to focus on.
If anything of this has been answered before my post I apologize and admit I'm a tool.

Your MS in full mythic gear is only 36%. Gems / WF will raise it higher, but you won't be at risk of capping it in the first tier, so I wouldn't worry about that. After MS, there is no "One Stat To Rule Them All." Depends on your talents / current gear. You'll need to sim yourself at that point.

No idea why others are not stacking MS. My guess is they got shafted by loot and simply don't have the the gear with MS rolled on it.

[Frosted]

Ah I see, thanks for the reply.

In your simulation, how do you handle the staggered cooldowns of frozen orb and PC? Whats the optimal way to use these two?

Lets use an example of a 3:15 fight, obviously you use both on the opener, then 1 minute in your orb comes back up. You could use it there, and then at 1:30 into the fight have a comparatively weak power crystal since there's no orb to guarantee you can spam lance. Then at 2 minutes you get another frost orb, then at 3 minutes you get to use them both again. Alternatively you could use frozen orb as if it had a 90 second cooldown, and only use it with PC. Have you run any tests on which one is better?

any thoughts on this?

Things came up. Looking into it. When I have an anwser I'm more confident in giving you I'll give it.

EDIT: Bank FO for PC.

[Frozenbro]

So its better to save FO until PC is off cd, i was using FO on cd, nice to know, if blizz isnt going to buff frostbolt then i hope they lower PC cd to 1 min so cds can line up again, the fact that PC has 1.5 min cd kinda screws our rotation.

[Frosted]

We suggested it be shifted away from a 1min CD early on in the beta to combat how potent FO+PC can be.

[Pwnzz]

Hey guys, new to the forums.

So, on the trinket comparisons I didn't see the dark moon trinket. I have that plus the draenic philosopher's stone and a warforged ragewing. What would be the best combo from these 3?

Also, assuming I get a copeland' trinket, what should I use with these four trinkets?